Learn how the Rev. Ben Roberts bridges spirituality and action, helping the unhoused and shaping city policies in Washington, D.C.
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What happens when prayer meets practical action? In this compelling episode of Compass: Finding Spirituality in the Everyday, host Ryan Dunn sits down with Reverend Ben Roberts, Director of Social Justice Ministries at Foundry United Methodist Church in Washington, D.C.
Together, they explore how faith, justice and tangible service intersect on city streets—especially in the fight against homelessness. Ben takes us behind the scenes of his work balancing outreach programs, such as meal and clothing ministries, with systemic advocacy at city hall. Dive deep into stories of real people overcoming the hidden barriers of homelessness, the spiritual drive to serve, and how community can become a catalyst for justice. From the struggles created by new ID laws to the emotional toll of encampment clearings, this conversation reveals both the challenges and hope alive in social justice ministry.
About our guest:
The Rev. Ben Roberts has served as the Director of Social Justice Ministries at Foundry UMC in Washington, D.C., since 2013. With over a decade of experience bridging hands-on outreach and policy advocacy, Ben’s unique calling lies at the intersection of sanctuary and street. He is especially passionate about removing barriers for those experiencing homelessness through initiatives like ID assistance, feeding programs and coalition-building with local and federal partners. Ben’s ministry demonstrates how spirituality can fuel lasting change—one prayer, one policy, and one neighbor at a time.
Episode Notes:
Learn more about the ID ministry at Foundry United Methodist Church in Washington, D.C.
Related Episodes:
- Championing justice and hope with Rev. Ingrid McIntyre [162]
- Cultivating empathy in polarized times with John Pavlovitz [133]
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This episode posted on October 1, 2025
Episode Transcript:
Ryan Dunn [00:00:00]:
There are instances when a piece of legislation just might open the door to the miracle that someone is praying for. Hey, and welcome back to Compass Finding Spirituality in the Everyday My name is Ryan Dunn. In this episode I'm joined by Reverend Ben Roberts, who is Director of Social Justice Ministries at Foundry United Methodist church in Washington, D.C. ben shares a behind the scenes look at his unique role, balancing hands on outreach like feeding programs and ID assistance with community advocacy and city council engagement. The conversation that we have dives into the intersecting worlds of faith, justice and practical support, especially for those experiencing homelessness. Ben opens up about how spirituality fuels his work, the power of community, and the importance of seeing and serving those often overlooked in our cities. Along the way, you're going to hear about the real challenges posed by recent policy changes in dc, stories of hard fought victories, and how every person can play a part in creating meaningful change. Whether you're new to the world of social justice or looking for hope and inspiration in tough times, this episode should help us imagine what's possible when we look at faithfully removing roadblocks to answering someone's need based prayers.
Ryan Dunn [00:01:32]:
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Ryan Dunn [00:01:52]:
Five star rating or whatever you feel we've warranted. So thanks so much for that.
Ryan Dunn [00:01:58]:
Now I've known Reverend Bed Roberts for several years. We were ordained as deacons together a while back, but I didn't know much about his backstory prior to our paths crossing as adults. So thankfully he shares some of that with us and what led him into his unique expression of ministry in Washington, dc. So so let's get to know Ben a little bit better and hear about how faith is moving from the sanctuary to the streets here on Compass.
Ryan Dunn [00:02:27]:
Ben, first, thanks for joining us on Compass. I'm guessing that not every church or every church member is familiar with a Director of Social Justice Ministries. And I know that's just one of the hats that you wear at Foundry United Methodist Church. But can you paint a picture for us what the role of the Director of Social Justice Ministries looks like?
Ben Roberts [00:02:48]:
Yes, certainly. Glad to be with you Ryan. So my ministry here at Foundry, I've been here now 12 years and I started as the Director of Social justice ministries in 2013. Foundry's fortunate to be able to have A full time position like that. But, but basically what it looked like is caring for all of our direct service efforts. And when I say direct service, you think about feeding programs, clothing programs, you know, going out cooking at different places, doing our service, days out in the community, picking up trash, whatever it happens to be anything that's going to meet an immediate physical need that somebody has. But what it also encompasses is being able to do some community organizing and advocacy work with interfaith partners and going out and being able to work directly with the Washington D.C. city Council and the mayor's office to try and direct the policies that we have here in town.
Ben Roberts [00:03:56]:
We have been particularly focused on chronic homelessness over these years. And then ID policy, which we can talk a little bit about because of one of our direct service programs that does non driver's IDs and birth certificates. And every once in a while we'll do something Federal either with GBCs or if something once in a while something else will pop up like an ID policy moving through Congress or something. We'll go and we'll try and make sure that there's a voice there as well.
Ryan Dunn [00:04:26]:
I don't know. So we've ever had this conversation and I'm just kind of curious about it. You're ordained in the United Methodist Church and I'm wondering like what kind of came first? What was the horse and what was the wagon? Was it the ordination that then brought along with it this pursuit of social justice or was it you were really passionate about the work in advocacy efficacy and then that led you into the ordination?
Ben Roberts [00:04:53]:
Yeah, concurrent probably. All right. But they were think middle school age and luckily, and we're both from North Carolina conference, the conference had a great youth program when I was growing up. And one of the events was called our annual conference session. And it was the chance for the high school kids to get together and write little right resolutions, say, pick up a topic, say here's what we feel about it, debate it amongst each other, vote on it, pass it and send it off to elected leaders. And that kind of laid a foundation for me that we have a voice, we have something important to say and the church cares about things. The church isn't just about getting us to do the right rituals. It's not about just getting us to, I don't know, say Jesus 10 times.
Ben Roberts [00:05:49]:
It's about having an impact. Our Wesleyan tradition calls us to have a social witness as the church. And that's what I was brought up in. So that is what kind of got me going. I Had a sense that whole time of something about ordination or church leadership. But it's also the case in, probably in a lot of conferences. But in North Carolina, the sense growing up was there are elders and there is Duke University and there is not much else.
Ryan Dunn [00:06:22]:
Right.
Ben Roberts [00:06:23]:
And it took a while. It takes a long time to figure out that those aren't the only options. The deacon order as an ordained piece hasn't been around that long, you know, 96. So people are still learning how to talk about it even at this point. But as I got clarity that I wanted to do something about faith in the public square, that's what kind of put my attention on there being a seminary in Washington, D.C. i was an undergrad. I pulled a book off of the shelf in one of my classrooms that just happened to list all of the Methodist schools. And I was just flipping through that book and I found Wesley.
Ben Roberts [00:07:04]:
And I was like, oh, well, if there's a seminary in D.C. then that's probably a good place to do some learning around faith in the public square.
Ryan Dunn [00:07:13]:
So all along you were thinking a part of your ministry, so to speak, was gonna be like showing up to city council meetings, something.
Ben Roberts [00:07:24]:
I think I was a little more grandiose when I was coming up.
Ryan Dunn [00:07:29]:
More like, more like organizing actions on the steps of the Capitol.
Ben Roberts [00:07:33]:
Probably. Probably, yeah. And because I was familiar with what gbcs did. Right. And so if I, if I had known better, if, if I had better questions to ask, maybe when I was younger, maybe I could have figured it, but I had zero intention. This is, this still cracks me up a little bit. But I had zero intention of ever working in a local church. And I have now been here in this local church for, for 12 years and, and basically my entire adult ministry.
Ben Roberts [00:08:02]:
Yeah.
Ryan Dunn [00:08:04]:
One of the ministries that has been sponsored through the church you've already talked about is foundries ID ministry. And I would love for you to paint a picture for us about how that works and maybe even naming why obtaining proper identification is such a crucial step for somebody that's in a vulnerable position regarding like housing, health care, or employment.
Ben Roberts [00:08:31]:
Absolutely. So we do have the ID ministry. Its main purpose is to help get you your birth certificate, Social Security card, or non driver's id. The reason we do it is, as you've kind of alluded to it, is a barrier. You don't get housing without producing an id. You do not get a job without producing an id, and you're not going to be able to apply for public benefits if you need them. You can't even Enroll your kid in school if you don't have some form of ID for them as well. So birth certificates are usually the first thing that people are getting for their kids is they're hitting pre K3 or, or kindergarten.
Ben Roberts [00:09:10]:
So what we've found over the years, this ministry has been going close to 26, 27 years at this point. I came in in 2013. In 2014, the Real ID act passed through Congress and that changed the way that we do. Well, excuse me, it passed back in the early 2000s. It came into effect in Washington D.C. in 2014 and now everybody has seen it over the last like eight to 10 months because it's becoming into effect nationwide and you can't get on a plane anymore without a real ID. Well, what happened for us in 2014 is we went overnight from being able to help people apply for their IDs with not too much friction. You still had a lot of proving to do.
Ben Roberts [00:09:58]:
But we had these additions of things like two proofs of address and you must produce like multiple proofs of identity plus legal, legal status in the, in the country. We dropped from having around an 83% success rate to a 39% success rate overnight. And it was actually, it went into effect on a Thursday. We had our ID ministry on a Friday morning and pretty much everybody that met with us that day was doomed for failure. And we had no idea. We got a lot more professional with our work at that point. We had to get really good at like fitting the puzzle pieces together, the kind of nonsense that when you're in an emergency situation, you got evicted or you're in survival mode because you're outside, if you're in a domestic violence situation, any of those things, you're not thinking about how to put all these little pieces together and it can delay you for forever. So that's the kind of work that the volunteers do, is, is to help you navigate the process and then we'll help you pay for the credential if you need that help to pay for it.
Ryan Dunn [00:11:06]:
Yeah, in those situations, you're not thinking about grabbing the birth certificate before you go or.
Ben Roberts [00:11:12]:
No. And a lot of times in like a domestic violence situation, credentials and IDs are one of the things that the abusive partner usually holds over the rest of the family, basically. So we have to work really hard to help people replace that.
Ryan Dunn [00:11:28]:
Well, we're recording this in mid September of 2025. The events leading up to this time in history around Washington D.C. has been that the National Guard has been sent in, in what's been proclaimed as an emergency situation. You know, we can get into all of that, but my, my first question regarding that is, has. Has this presence disrupted your ministry in that regard?
Ben Roberts [00:12:00]:
Yeah. So the biggest disruption, again, we do a lot of work on chronic homelessness. And when you're working with a. With an unhoused population at all, one of the hardest things to do is stay in contact with people. So even if you. If you've got somebody who's really well put together, they're not suffering from like compounded stress and trauma. And I have a. Mental health issues, whatever.
Ben Roberts [00:12:26]:
Even in the best case scenario, keeping in contact with somebody is the thing that delays people probably the most. You lose your phone, your stuff gets thrown out, you have to move from site to site. So anytime that's in play, it makes it harder. So what we saw immediately as they kind of made it a priority to what they call. They call it clearing encampments. And this is something that the city does. The city of Washington, D.C. does this.
Ben Roberts [00:13:00]:
The White House just kind of said they want to make it even more of a priority because there were tents near like the Kennedy center or down near the State Department. The reason people go to those places is because, you know, shelters can't take. They, they will not take everyone. Um, if you're married, there's not really shelters for you. We have, we have one and it just came online this year, and there's not enough space. If you have a pet, shelters will not, will not take you. And then shelters are frequently overcrowded. They're not the cleanest places in the world.
Ben Roberts [00:13:39]:
They're not the safest places in the world. You're basically tossed into a room with at least four other people that you've probably never met, some of whom may be experiencing really serious mental health issues. Others might just not like you. We see it a lot across race and ethnic lines where folks don't get along or they get targeted because of that. We see people have their belongings stolen. And then the shelter process, especially the low barrier shelter process, is kind of lined up around 4pm to get into a shelter that doesn't open until like 7pm and then you have to pack up all your stuff the next morning at 7am and be out of there and then find something to do with yourself all day. They're not centrally located. Some of them have services, some of them don't.
Ben Roberts [00:14:33]:
So when we see this disruption come of like encampment clearing, people lose belongings, they lose really critical elements like cell phones, and they get moved Away from the places where we know to find them. Yeah, so we have street outreach teams, we have caseworkers. We generally know where somebody is until they get pushed off the spot. And one of the big problems, and this is pre the emergency declaration, one of the biggest problems is people may not get full notice that a clearing is coming. The city had usually been good about giving multiple days worth of notice. But what we found out in this emergency is the city came around. Washington Circle is the area that I'm thinking of. This is in Foggy Bottom near George Washington University Hospital.
Ben Roberts [00:15:29]:
And like a hospital is a great resource to have if you. If you need it. But. So Washington Circle was given notice. They were basically told it was on a Thursday. They were told, hey, this coming Monday will be back to clear you out. This is Friday night, excuse me, Monday, we're coming to clear you guys out. So that's notice at least.
Ben Roberts [00:15:51]:
But what they did was actually came back about eight hours later on Saturday morning. And there was only one person still in their tent at that time. Because what you do during the day is you go find food, you go meet with your caseworker, you go get a shower, you take care of yourself. So there was only one person actually present in their tent. That person was allowed to kind of pack up their belongings. Anybody else's stuff was just tossed in the garbage truck and drove off. So there's no telling right away from that who lost what. But.
Ben Roberts [00:16:25]:
But I. I've seen it plenty of times, like critical documents, phones, things that you need get tossed and it just delays you further and further. So that in that way we're massively disrupted. The other piece is we don't know where those folks go next. So we used to find you here. Now where are you? We don't know if you went to shelter. We don't know if you slipped over into Virginia or Maryland. We don't know if you just kind of got pushed up north into the residential neighborhoods, which is what we've seen a lot here.
Ben Roberts [00:16:57]:
Like at the church, we kind of had an aberration there prior to the emergency where we didn't have people sleeping on our steps for multiple weeks. It's rarely like that here. But we didn't have people sleeping on our own steps for a really long time until the emergency was declared. Now I've got new people out there that I'm meeting for the first time that, you know, fine, we have rules around it, but we try not to run people away. I meet with them, I have outreach come and Meet with them. It's a predictable, safe spot for folks who don't feel like they can be safe in the shelter. Lots of folks who are Hispanic tend to stay out there and all of that. You know, we've got some parameters around it and people are good neighbors with us, but we weren't having that for a little while until the emergency was declared.
Ben Roberts [00:17:52]:
And what we see now in our neighborhood is individuals on little corners, which just adds weight, and individuals over in parks where we had never actually seen people before. And it adds weight onto the outreach workers because now they're spread out geographically and you have to, you're doing a lot more literal legwork to try and go find and keep track of people. And there's no guarantee they're going to be there more than one night. So it just, it makes everything harder.
Ryan Dunn [00:18:23]:
In a best case scenario, how long does it take for somebody to get the identification that they need?
Ben Roberts [00:18:32]:
Yeah, best case scenario is about a month. So if you, if you come to me and you've got, you've got nothing on hand but say you were born here in D.C. and you've got at least some kind of document ready, it's going to, you can go and do your birth certificate in person, you can apply in person for your Social Security card, but it'll get mailed and that's up to 14 days. And then once you have those items, plus your proofs of address, you go to the DMV, you'll get a temporary 30 day paper ID. And this is probably pretty uniform across the country at this point. You get this temporary paper ID, but then your hard ID, plastic card is going to be another 10 to 14 days to get mailed. So, yeah, month at best. But we've seen all kinds.
Ben Roberts [00:19:24]:
Yeah, yeah.
Ryan Dunn [00:19:25]:
And so this kind of clearing out can be a disruption then that just prolongs this sense of keeping people where, where they are in these vulnerable positions. Is that kind of what you see happening? Quite a bit.
Ben Roberts [00:19:39]:
You see that? Yeah, I mean, ID is always a barrier. So. So when the city, and in this case when the federal government is kind of trying to direct the city to do more of it, when, when we have those pieces go away, you're automatically going to get stuck out there for a longer period of time. And what's already a pretty long process because of the amount of resources and.
Ryan Dunn [00:20:03]:
Housing available, I'm guessing that you've been able to reconnect with some of the people who may have been displaced through this whole process. Have you gotten a sense of the kind of emotional toll that it takes on people to go through something like that.
Ben Roberts [00:20:19]:
I have not had success getting reconnected with quite a few of the people that we actually followed. This is part of the problem. So what we've been doing in the wake of the different clearings is I'm reaching out to the caseworkers and case managers that I know, and I'm like, hey, I see somebody at 17th and Q. Can you send somebody over? Hey, I see somebody in this park. Can you send somebody over? But the people. I've only reconnected with one person who used to stay on our steps and just recently popped up again just in this last week. And so I can tell, you know, it just pushes people further and further back. And what it does is it also makes people withdraw, because if, you know you're being targeted, and in this case they are being targeted, they'll.
Ben Roberts [00:21:12]:
They'll withdraw further and further, and they'll try and have less and less contact. So they'll try and be as invisible as possible, which, of course, makes you hard to find. And so I'm witnessing some of my people who now they'll kind of. They'll completely hunker down to the point of, like, covering themselves in blankets and kind of hide and sleeping in ways that none of us would want to sleep, tucking themselves in behind, like, little carts or plants or something like that, just to try and stay hidden enough so that they're not going to get messed with. The gap of trust that exists when we pursue policies like this is just enormous, and it takes a lot to overcome it. And again, this is something that we've seen both by the city. Other cities do it, too. In this case, it was being directed and sped up with little notice so that you couldn't even kind of get to your people beforehand.
Ryan Dunn [00:22:09]:
You talked about going to city council meetings. You're there as a pastoral presence. I mean, you're there to be an advocate, but also as a pastoral presence. And with that, then comes this sense of spiritual direction. And can. Can you talk a little bit about how you are applying that spiritual direction as you're addressing people in the sort of. That administrative complex?
Ben Roberts [00:22:38]:
Yeah. So I was mentioning this to the. To our. To our conference, the North Carolina annual conference, this. This past summer. I feel like one barrier that maybe people in the church in general, laity or clergy alike, is that you might think you need to go and be the expert on policy, for example, or on statistics to be able to go and have a voice in that type of setting, and it's just not. It's not the case. And constantly, when coalition partners ask me to come and talk about chronic homelessness and solutions, they usually frame it, and they'll say to me, ben, can you come and do the moral argument? Okay.
Ben Roberts [00:23:22]:
Which for a long time set me on a path of, like, trying to find the. The exact sort of mathematic equation of what a moral argument is. And so I.
Ryan Dunn [00:23:33]:
How'd that go?
Ben Roberts [00:23:34]:
Yeah, if I had to try. And I was like, well, what exactly is a moral argument? I was like, so I've tried to piece these things together in such a way that I. That I'm speaking, you know, clarity from. From our. From our perspective as Christians and from my perspective as a pastor who works with people on these issues. And so what I've been trying to encourage people to realize is you don't need to be the policy expert. Let the experts be the experts. We need to go and be the church.
Ben Roberts [00:24:08]:
That's our role in this. And so what that looks like is, for me, especially early on, I would think about. If you think about a healing narrative in the gospel, so many of our healing narratives in the gospel will have a place where they're going to have Jesus first speaking to a crowd of people that are in the way of the healing that needs to take place. So there's one healing narrative. There's two blind individuals off the side of the road, and they're walking along, and the crowd is kind of telling them to shut up and stop yelling over for Jesus. And Jesus has to overcome that first. The woman who crawls her way through the crowd to try and get to Jesus just to touch the cloak and be healed again. The crowd is in the way, the crowd that surrounds the house, such that the friends need to pick up their paralytic friend, navigate through the crowd, rip the roof off of the house, and lower him down to be able to get to Jesus again.
Ben Roberts [00:25:13]:
The crowd is a barrier. And so when I go and I. And we hear things like we're trying to put resources in place around homelessness or affordable housing, there's usually a crowd. There's usually a crowd who's out there saying, no, I don't want that built near me or in my neighborhood.
Ryan Dunn [00:25:33]:
Yeah, not in my backyard. Mindset.
Ben Roberts [00:25:35]:
Okay, some of that mindset. Exactly. And so. So then what am I there to do? Well, I'm. Now I'm here to tell you a gospel story about what it takes to get healing in place. Even in the case of Jesus, who can do all the stuff. There's usually still a crowd in the way. And so what.
Ben Roberts [00:25:52]:
What needs to be said to the crowd in this moment as the theological witness, as the Christian witness, as the church witness. And so that's. That's the kind of mindset I go in with. I have told the stories of healing there. I've literally sat in my testimony to city council and said, you know, you're in a position more than most people to be able to say to somebody, basically, okay, the resources in place now roll up your mat, take it, and go to what is now going to be your home. Which is how Jesus spoke to the. To one person who was healed. He said, roll up your mat and go home.
Ben Roberts [00:26:29]:
You're. You're. You're. You're free and clear. You're ready to go. So, so that's kind of the. That's what I take in there. So it's a teaching moment.
Ben Roberts [00:26:39]:
And I. And I've been able to do that with integrity because they wanted to build a shelter right right beside my house. I live in a complex in Southwest D.C. they wanted to put in a family shelter and my own neighborhood. And so it's not just the city council like my own. My own kind of condo board met. And I had just moved in. I hadn't even lived there two weeks.
Ben Roberts [00:27:05]:
But they. My condo board met. This was my introduction to my condo board and my neighbors, they were meeting to figure out how to torpedo the family homeless shelter. And I showed up at that meeting and I listened to them all talk about, what can we do to stop this thing? And then I just. I had to be the voice in the room to say, I love it. I love this idea. It should be built here. I work in the shelters where we're warehousing families.
Ben Roberts [00:27:31]:
I know the conditions that they're dealing with. We had had an individual disappear from the D.C. general Shelter, which was an abandoned hospital. And we needed a change. And so I was there with my neighbors and then with my council members to be able to say, you know, no, the thing that needs to happen, and it can happen right here in my own backyard, please, is better, safer shelters that people aren't going to be impacted the way that they're being now. So this is what I take in there. The other piece that we know that other groups just don't know and they can't bring, the experts can't bring this, is that when I'm meeting with people through our feeding ministries, through our clothing ministries, through our ID ministry, I'm Hearing their stories, I'm asking about what they're praying for. This is the pastoral and not the theological end.
Ben Roberts [00:28:24]:
I know that they're praying for jobs. I know that they're praying for housing. These are the prayers they are sending up to God. These are the prayers they're asking me to hold with them. I walk into a city council member's office and I'm talking with their staff or I'm talking directly with them. I can directly say to you, you have the power in this moment more than me and more than any of these experts and caseworkers to help answer somebody's prayer. God puts tools. Jesus encourages us to be the hands and feet.
Ben Roberts [00:28:58]:
You have that power right in this moment with your vote, with your policy, to help answer somebody's prayer. The other groups can't say that. We can say that as the church, because those are the stories that we get. So. So that's what it looks. That's what it looks like for me when I'm going into these settings. I try my best to stay on top of the policy and on the stats and the statistics and the need and everything else and best practice. But what we're best positioned to do is to be the pastoral presence in that way, and the theological and Christian witness in a way that really moves the ball forward for people's prayers, for their safety, for their practical needs, for meeting those.
Ben Roberts [00:29:46]:
Those mercy and justice needs that our communities have.
Ryan Dunn [00:29:51]:
Sounds a little bit like you were in the minority in terms of that. That shelter going in near your house. Is that project moving forward?
Ben Roberts [00:30:00]:
Yeah. Oh, no, it got built great. Okay. It went back to the drawing board, what ended up happening. And people should take. Take encouragement here. It doesn't take that many voices to go and be positive on this. Usually when a project like that comes up.
Ben Roberts [00:30:17]:
Well, it doesn't matter if it's a project like that. Usually on any policy proposal, council members, elected leaders, they usually only hear from angry people who don't want it to happen. People who are in favor of something don't tend to show up, and that's a problem. So don't let it be. Don't think it's a foregone conclusion that, hey, just because this is a. It's a moral thing to do, it's a. It's the right thing to do, that that's going to go through. Like people still need to hear support for something, not just the negative voices.
Ben Roberts [00:30:52]:
So what ended up happening in that case is I didn't. I didn't sit there and Slay Goliath or something. What ended up happening was that our community, both my condo community and there, my wider neighborhood said, let's take one more look at this and find a better and find a solution. And what ended up happening is it moved not even one block. Not even one block. It moved half a block south of its original proposed site. That's it. You can find ways forward if you're willing to talk to each other.
Ben Roberts [00:31:29]:
People aren't always willing, especially right now, they're not willing to talk to each other. You can find a way forward. So all, all we needed to do was move it a half a block south. We were good to go and the, and the space got built and it's been up and running probably close to eight, eight, nine years now. Oh, all right. All right.
Ryan Dunn [00:31:48]:
So wonderful. Well established. Cool. I, I was asking about that because there can be. There's those moments of success and you need to hang on to those there. There's plenty of fit of. Not failure, but setbacks, disappointments that, that come along with work like this as well. In any profession, people are always encouraged to keep some kind of affirmation file, right? Like, oh, you keep that email that congratulates on something or you tuck away that story where you really hit the mark and had success.
Ryan Dunn [00:32:19]:
And I'm wondering if there is a story that you kind of keep tucked in the mental library that you can go back to when you feel like, man, today's gonna not be good. I need this motivation and I'm glad you asked that.
Ben Roberts [00:32:36]:
So once in a while I gotta, you know, we all have pastor friends. We do stuff for each other. I've had a pastor friend who once in a while he'll. He'll need to use my office for something. Actually, I'm gonna call him out. His. Reverend Scott Bostick. He's a member of the Baltimore Washington Annual Conference.
Ben Roberts [00:32:53]:
He serves a church in Baltimore right now. Every once in a while, he would need to use my office for something or he's covered. He covered a wedding for me when my second child was born. It just happened to fall that way. But when he uses my office, he'll do stuff like this. He'll walk around in my office and he'll put little. Can you see that? He'll put little post it notes.
Ryan Dunn [00:33:15]:
There we go.
Ben Roberts [00:33:16]:
Stick them all over the place.
Ryan Dunn [00:33:17]:
So say people like you.
Ben Roberts [00:33:19]:
People like you right as annoying. And I mean, he'll put way too many of them. So I get rid of most of them. But I'll leave a Couple just to give me a little smile. Yeah, I'll do that. But I'm glad you asked because this weekend, actually, I had to preach this weekend at Foundry and I had to preach on Serve Joyfully, which we're. I'm not in a joyful mood right now. It's not really.
Ben Roberts [00:33:43]:
It's not fun right now. Like military occupation, all this other stuff, my homeless people getting bounced around. It's not. I'm not happy, as it were, mood wise. And I was trying to. And I was wrestling with that in the sermon and telling the congregation this. And one of the stories I brought up for them and for myself was I was on a walk a couple of weeks ago with somebody who used to sleep on the Foundry steps. And this person, they, they had a lot of trust issues.
Ben Roberts [00:34:13]:
I'm just going to leave it at that because, you know, we're on a podcast. I don't want to talk too much about it. Well, I helped that person move literally from our steps into their apartment. And this is after he. They had lived there for months. We had worked together for months. He, that person trusted me. I had introduced them to a caseworker.
Ben Roberts [00:34:35]:
We slowly ID process all of that stuff, got that person into housing, and then I had the opportunity because they trusted me, to pick them up in the car with another person from our church. We cleaned out their storage unit, we took them to their apartment, and they slept in there for the first time indoors in years. And I was on this walk with them a couple of weeks ago and reminding them about this and kind of nudging them a little bit because one item that they had in the storage locker were just these dumbbells, like just a couple of shirts and some shorts and then literal weights. Okay. And I was like, you realize you were just having us move around. Dead weight for you, right? All right. When we moved you into your apartment, and they were like, yeah, I've still got the weight at the apartment, but I've been housed now for. For eight years.
Ben Roberts [00:35:38]:
It's been eight years since we did that. That makes. That is a space where I am quite joyful in my service and one that I do hold on to, especially right now when, you know, both at our city level in the district, but also at the federal level, massive cuts are happening to the types of things that were in place to help get this person housed. And it worked. And if they didn't have that, they never would have been housed and they wouldn't have been able to stay housed if it wasn't Permanent supportive housing. They would have been back on the street immediately. It would have cost us more to have them on the street. It would have cost them more physically, mentally, spiritually to be on the street.
Ben Roberts [00:36:22]:
You know, I keep that. I keep stories like that around because when the talking points are all, housing first doesn't work, Housing doesn't work. And those are the talking points that are out there right now. And the cuts that we're seeing, I'm like, one, it does work. Two, I've seen it work, and I've seen it make real transformative difference in people's lives. And they can testify to it. And I can testify to it.
Ryan Dunn [00:36:52]:
You know, I remember you telling me at some point over our conversations over the years, it's such a. Maybe it was even flippant. You were being flippant. But I was asking about how do we deal with homelessness? And your response was like, well, the only people that are. The only way to overcome homelessness is to get people into housing, which is so simplistic. And yet the matter of. Well, it's the heart of the matter, right?
Ben Roberts [00:37:26]:
Yeah. I think one thing that maybe people wonder about is we've tried. We've tried to be careful with our language. So because it makes a difference, like, words have power. It's just true. So we've worked really hard not to call people homeless. They're just. Because that.
Ben Roberts [00:37:50]:
It in your brain, you know, suddenly you're thinking, oh, well, that person's homeless. Like, it's sort of permanent label on somebody, and it makes it seem like it can't move. It's not true. Like, it's just a person. They're experiencing homelessness. Like, right now, they do not live indoors. That's. That's what's true.
Ben Roberts [00:38:12]:
If you put them indoors, they're just your neighbor. Okay. Yeah.
Ryan Dunn [00:38:17]:
This is amazing how the whole identity changes. Yeah.
Ben Roberts [00:38:20]:
They were your neighbor before experiencing homelessness. Now they're just a neighbor who's also indoors. So, yes, as the simplistic. The math is always the same on this one. If you are housed, you are not homeless. That that's all there is to it. And if you. So the complexity comes with, like, how many.
Ben Roberts [00:38:42]:
You know, how much housing is available, is it affordable? What types of barriers exist to getting into the housing. That's where the complexity comes in. And are we allocating the types of resources necessary to get people in, or are we. Those are the complex parts. But as far as, like, who is unhoused and who is housed, it's just whoever's not in housing. So put them in housing and they are now no longer unhoused.
Ryan Dunn [00:39:09]:
Well, the ID ministry to me became one of those logical first steps to removing a barrier to housing. And undoubtedly somebody else is listening to this and thinking the same thing. Do you have advice of where to start for empowering people to find their IDs or to start an assistive program like you're running through Foundry?
Ben Roberts [00:39:34]:
Yeah. Oh, good. Great, great stuff, Ryan. I. We have been as forthright as we can be. We'll support anyone, church, community, group, whatever. If somebody wanted to start an ID ministry similar to what we have going, we'll share with you whatever you want. Because we had to get really good at every state.
Ben Roberts [00:40:00]:
Plus the multiple jurisdiction, like New York City, for example, is a separate jurisdiction than New York State. New York City has their own birth certificates. You, you may not, you're not going to know that unless you were born there. So we had to get really good at that. So we keep what we call our state book. We've got like kind of the shortest path for every jurisdiction that you can think of. It would take you forever to try and put that together if you were trying to start something new. So if you want to start something new, you can call us, you can reach out to us, emails, and we'll help provide that information so that you could get going.
Ben Roberts [00:40:39]:
There's a few organizations like this sincerely has been coming along. Arizona is the one that comes to mind immediately. They've actually got like a public private partnership in place that does some of this. There have been more that have popped up because of states that have voter ID laws. So there's a nationwide group called Vote Ride that does this to help individuals get in place what they need for like a voter id. But the process is the exact same. So all of the baseline foundational process is the exact same for getting the ID as for then getting a voter id. So you can even.
Ben Roberts [00:41:21]:
There's probably, there might be one, one of those kind of chapters in your area. And you could, you could either learn from them, you could volunteer with them, I guess, if you want to work on voter ID stuff. But you could also learn from them some of the process in your local area if you then wanted to do something just focused around non driver's IDs, birth certificate, Social Security card. Because everybody, and it doesn't matter, you know, everybody wants people off the street, as it were. There's, there's not a group that's out there, like I really want people. No one is saying that. No one's out there saying that. So it doesn't, it doesn't matter political stripe on this one.
Ben Roberts [00:42:03]:
We disagree a little bit about how best to do it, but everybody wants it to happen.
Ryan Dunn [00:42:08]:
Yeah, yeah.
Ben Roberts [00:42:09]:
Idaho is going to be a barrier either way. Whatever, whatever route you choose ID as a barrier either way. So that's what I would kind of say, like, you access some of the resources that are already there. We are here. We are so happy to help support somebody if they want to launch something. And just let us know, like, don't reinvent the wheel. Like, we got a really good wheel over here. Let us know.
Ben Roberts [00:42:37]:
Cool.
Ryan Dunn [00:42:38]:
Will they find contact information through, like, the church website?
Ben Roberts [00:42:41]:
Church website, absolutely. Otherwise, it's just idministryounderumc.org perfect. All right.
Ryan Dunn [00:42:49]:
Well, Ben, always good to talk to you. Thanks so much for giving the time this morning.
Ben Roberts [00:42:54]:
100%. Ryan. Thank you for reaching out. Blessings on you and your continued ministry as you share the story for us.
Ryan Dunn [00:43:00]:
Appreciate it.
Ben Roberts [00:43:01]:
Thanks, man.
Ryan Dunn [00:43:03]:
That wraps up this episode of Compass, Finding Spirituality in the Everyday Life. If you would like to dive deeper into anything that we've talked about today, be sure to visit our [email protected] Compass you'll find episode notes, helpful links, and even more episodes that you can check out right there. A big thank you goes out to the amazing team at United Methodist Communications for making this podcast possible. We're grateful for the support and dedication behind the scenes. And of course, if you have, if you haven't already, we'd love for you to subscribe, rate and review Compass. Wherever you get your podcasts, it only takes a moment. It really helps more folks find the podcast and for us to connect with.
Ryan Dunn [00:43:44]:
More people to talk to.
Ryan Dunn [00:43:45]:
Thank you for listening. We'll see you next time. Peace.
